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Hellgate : London vs Guild Wars

7 Nov 2007 | Flash, Guild Wars, Hellgate : London |  48 comments
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A week had passed since the official world wide launch of Hellgate : London, an over hyped PC Game developed by Flagship Studios, founded by former executives of Blizzard North, a division of Blizzard Entertainment.

Given that ArenaNet was also founded by former employees of Blizzard, why don’t we compare the two offsprings and see who got the better genes –

Hellgate : London vs Guild Wars, let the showdown begin!

Hellgate : London vs Guild Wars : Prophesies
Note: Guild Wars’ initial retail launch build back in 26 April 2005 is used for this comparison, it is only fair to compare initial retail launch builds against one another.
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(Click here to page down and cast your vote into the poll)

The List of Rounds involved:
Round 1 : Gaming Sites Review Scores
Round 2 : Business Model
Round 3 : Multiplayer
Round 4 : Player versus Player – PvP
Round 5 : Skills
Round 6 : Respecs (Re-specification)
Round 7 : Inventory System – Item Management
Round 8 : Emotes and Dances
Round 9 : Stability – Server, Build Updates, Initial Launch, etc
Round 10 : Environment, Explorable Areas, Towns, Outposts, etc

_____________________________________________________

Round 1 : Gaming Sites Review Scores (Back to the list)

Gamespot
Hellgate : London | Released : 31 October 2007 | 7.0 – Good

“Hellgate: London has plenty of neat ideas, but many of them aren’t executed as well as you’d like.”

Guild Wars | Released : 26 April 2005 | 9.2 – Editors’ Choice

“It’s a very impressive game that’s rewarding on many different levels and can be tremendously appealing for any number of reasons.”

If we just compared Gamespot’s scores and editor’s notes alone, we already have a winner here, but let’s be fair and take a look at review scores of some other notable gaming sites.

Average ratio based on Gameranking.com :-

89% – Guild Wars | 74% – Hellgate : London

For various comprehensive player written reviews, check out gamefaqs:

Guild Wars | Hellgate : London

Guild Wars has 37 user submitted reviews in gamefaqs, highest score 10/10, lowest score 5/10, and an average score of 8.57/10.00

Hellgate : London has 7 user submitted reviews in gamefaqs, highest score 8/10, lowest score 3/10, giving an average score of 5.86/10.00

It ain’t gonna take a genius to figure out who is the winner for this round aye? I hereby declare the winner of Round 1 to be – Guild Wars! Hip! Hip! Hoorah!

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Round 2 : Business Model (Back to the list)

Guild Wars No monthly subscription fees, not now, not ever

– Releases new standalone chapters playable right out of the box for recurring income (Released 2 standalone chapters: Factions & Nightfall, 1 expansion: Eye of the North)

Hellgate : London “Basic” online multiplayer gameplay is playable free right out of the box, while the monthly subscription is “Optional”.

– Subscribers gets more “benefits” (Click here for more details)

– Limited “Lifetime” subscription offer at a cost of USD149.99

Personally, I detest online games that requires a monthly subscription. Hellgate : London is slightly different as its subscription is purely “optional”.

Anyway, let’s analzye Hellgate : London’s subscribers’ benefits in detail and compare it against Guild Wars:

  • Hardcore Mode
    • [The “Survivor” title which is similar to “Hardcore Mode” is certainly better than it, as you do not lose access to your character permanently.]
  • Guild Creation and Management
    • [In Guild Wars, you only need to pay 100 in game gold in order to create a guild. No reason to further bill the players for such trifle matters, right?]
  • Larger Stash
    • [Guild Wars have shared stash, capacity of stash is greatly increased following a recent stash update.]
  • Additional Character Slots
    • [Both Hellgate : London and Guild Wars have 6 different classes / professions, initially Guild Wars only offered 4 character slots, but later ArenaNET introduced the Guild Wars Online Store, which allowed players to purchase additional character slots at a cost of USD9.99 whereby Hellgate : London only offered 3 character slots to non-subscribing players while subscribers get 24 slots, as long as they continue to subscribe, of course.]
  • Themed Events and Quests
    • [“Themed Events and Quests” in Guild Wars are freely available to all players without any further charges of any kind.]
  • Unique Event Items
    • [Same as the above, “Unique Event Items” in Guild Wars are freely available to all players without any further charges of any kind.]
  • Special Event Pets
    • [“Special Event Pets” are “purchasable” through PC Gamer magazine, i.e. CD-KEYS distributed in certain issues of the PC Gamer magazine.]

Wait, we’re not finished yet:

  • New Levels to Explore
    • [“New Levels” in Guild Wars are available for purchase as new standalone Chapters or Expansion, once purchased, the player basically “owns” access to the said “New Levels” while in Hellgate : London the player loses access to these “New Levels” if they happen to suspend their subscription at any time.]
  • New Monsters
    • [Same as above.]
  • New Weapons
    • [Same as above.]
  • New Skills and Spells
    • [Same as above.]
  • New Character Classes
    • [Same as above.]
  • Raid-Level Areas
    • [When Guild Wars was first released back in 26 April 2005, these so called “Raid-Level Areas” are already freely available to all players, basically “The Underworld” and “The Fissure of Woe”.]
  • Seasonal / Themed Events and Items
    • [“Seasonal / Themed Events and Items” are freely available to all players.]
  • Additional Difficulty and Game Play Modes
    • [“Additional Difficulty” in Guild Wars, the so called “Hard Mode” was made available to all players as an update, as mentioned earlier above. At its initial release in 26 April 2005, there are already several different game modes available to all players.]
  • Additional PvP Modes and Rewards
    • [At its launch in 26 April 2005, Guild Wars already offered various PvP Modes. The PvP “Rewards” are made available to all players later as an update.]
  • Achievement Rewards
    • [In Guild Wars, “Titles” were freely introduced to all players as an update.]
  • Advanced Guild Management Tools
    • [I have no idea what kind of “Advanced Guild Management Tools” that Hellgate : London has to offer, can’t really comment much here.]
  • Web-based Rankings and Character Viewing
    • [Initially, Guild Wars only have web-based rankings for Guilds who participated in ranked Guild vs Guild PvP Battles. Since the release of Guild Wars : Nightfall, individual players who participate in ranked “Hero Battles” are able to access their web-based rankings.]

As we can clearly see, what Hellgate : London has to offer to its subscribers, Guild Wars offers to all its players who purchased the game.

Obviously, Guild Wars is the better choice here, in terms of economics, Guild Wars would allow fellow gamers to spend less and at the same time, play more. Now ain’t that a good thing?

Hellgate : London, on the other hand, requires players to fork out USD9.99 monthly for the so called “benefits” where Guild Wars is already providing to the players free of charge. Oh, and don’t forget that if you ever stop subscribing in Hellgate : London, you will lose access to all these so called “benefits” immediately. Neat feature aye?

Therefore, the winner of Round 2 is indeed Guild Wars! Again! As expected! Woot!

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Round 3 : Multiplayer (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – Maximum of 6 players in a party, i.e. you can only invite up to 5 players to join your party.

Guild Wars – When Guild Wars was first released in April 2005, up to 8 players per party in PvE. As for PvP, the “Tombs of the Primeval Kings” PvP Mode (Now known as “Heroes Ascent”) allows up to 6 teams of 8 in a single battle field! That’s a bloody 6 times 8 equal 48 players multiplayer mayhem in a single instance, and that’s 8 times the current max party size of Hellgate : London.

Let’s sum it up aye?

Hellgate : London – Max 6 people per combat instance

vs

Guild Wars – Max 48 people per combat instance

Note: “combat instance” basically means an instance where players are able to attack, activate skills, spells etc.

We all play online games because we want to play together with other players, right? Obviously, Guild Wars is doing a better job than Hellgate : London.

Folks, this is a no brainer! Guild Wars win the 3rd consecutive round! Awesome! Yeah!

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Round 4 : Player versus Player – PvP (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – In order to participate in Player versus Player (PvP) combat, players must either type “/duel <insert player name>” or type “/pvp” to “activate” PvP mode.

Guild Wars – During its initial launch in April 2005, the various PvP modes available to the players can be easily accessed by map traveling to the various PvP Outposts, where players can engage in Random or Team 4 players versus 4 players Competitive Matches, organize a party of 8 and test their worth in the tournament style PvP-Mode “Tombs of the Primeval Kings” or participate in the ultimate PvP mode – Guild vs Guild.

Again, Guild Wars offers various better PvP options while Hellgate : London’s PvP is quite lackluster in comparison, not to mention that its max player per combat instance is only 6 players! Need I say more?

So Guild Wars kicks Hellgate : London’s rear end real hard in Round 4! 4 Consecutive wins! Marvelous! Stupendous!

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Round 5 : Skills (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – The Cabalist Evoker, Cabalist Summoner and Templar Guardian have a choice of 27 skills while the Hunter Marksman, Hunter Engineer and Templar Blademaster have a choice of 26 skills.

Guild Wars – Each of the 6 core professions (Warrior, Ranger, Monk, Necromancer, Mesmer, Elementalist) have a choice of 75 skills, not to mention that your character can have a secondary profession, adding up to a choice of 150 skills. Did I mention that your character can also change his or hers secondary profession? That’s oh-my-gosh 450 skills for your selection leisure!

The more the merrier they say, its very clear that Guild Wars offer much more varied choices in selection of skills compared to Hellgate : London.

Winner of Round 5, Guild Wars! FIVE CONSECUTIVE WINS!
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Round 6 : Respecs (Re-specification) (Wikipedia defintion) (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – No respecs option, characters are unable to change their attributes or skill ranks, meaning if you messed up your build, that’s it. No experimenting different builds either, you would have to create a new character to accommodate that desire. And yeah, did I mention before that non-subscribers only have 3 character slots?

Guild Wars – Respecs option available via “Attribute Point Re-assignment“, players are able re-assign their attribute ranks to suit their current needs and desires. Players have 24/24 “Refund Points” that they can use to alter the ranks of their Attributes, spent “Refund Points” can be earned back through gaining a certain amount of experience points. It is worth noting that the “Refund Points” system was abolished after a certain build update, players are able to re-assign their attributes with much more freedom.

When it comes to flexibility of attributes and skills, Guild Wars wins this round hands down! Yawn. 6 wins already aye?
_____________________________________________________

Round 7 : Inventory System – Item Management (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – Very crude grid inventory system, characters’ inventory is made up of 6 columns by 12 rows grid boxes, while the “stash” is made up of 6 columns by 10 rows. Weapons and Armors come in various sizes, say Body armor is made up of 2 columns by 3 rows of grid boxes, head gear is made up of 2 columns by 2 rows of grid boxes, true to the very primitive stone age Diablo 2 inventory system. Now if you try real hard, you might be able to squeeze in about 10 to 15 items on your character and in your stash.

Guild Wars – 45 items per character, 20 items in shared stash. Through various build updates, the size of the shared stashed increased significantly. Now players are able to store up to 80 items in the shared stash, as well as 250 of each of the 33 common and rare crafting materials.

Ladies and gentlemen, more items is always good they say, especially the ability to horde more items. Apparently, Hellgate : London does not seem to be doing very well in this area. Again, I announce the winner of Round 7 – Guild Wars! Gosh, this is so predictable already!
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Round 8 : Emotes and Dances (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – None. Nada. Nothing.

Guild Wars – A variety of emotes that your character can perform by typing /<insert emote command here>, for a complete list check out the following url:
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Emotes
For a complete list of various dances, check out this url:
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Dance

When you just owned your opponent in a spectacular match and would like to dance over his or hers fallen body, then you realized that you are unable to do so, because you are playing Hellgate : London. Sorry, no dances, no emotes in Hellgate : London, move along now, nothing interesting to see here.

Now that would have pretty much sucked eh? Guild Wars, on the other hand, would not let you down as you many emotes to perform. Another no brainer. Guild Wars win this round. Enough said.
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Round 9 : Stability – Server, Build Updates, Initial Launch, etc (Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – Too many bugs, memory leaks, memory exhausted, character getting stuck in areas. Check out the following review by somethingawful.com if you don’t believe me, what’s even more shocking is that everything they wrote is so true!

http://www.somethingawful.com/d/news/hellgate-london-subscription.php

Its not even a month since its official launch and there are already server down times because they need to “update” their server.

Besides that, the South East Asian is seriously messed up. Check out the following url for the official wiki link for more details:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellgate:_London#Delay_of_Patch_0_and_Complaints
_of_Poor_Support_for_South_East_Asia_.28SEA.29_Server

Basically, SEA Hellgate : London players paid to play a beta build of the game online, as the SEA Hellgate : London game servers hosted by IAHGames are running the game servers on a beta build instead of a retail build.

By the way, head over here: http://forum.iahgames.com/hellgate/forumdisplay.php?f=65 to check out the angry mob of SEA players flooding the official forums for the SEA version of Hellgate : London. They certainly ain’t happy and they ain’t stopping until the issues are rectified, so far the issues still exist and IAHGames have yet to solve the problems.

However, this does not mean that the US / EU servers are doing much better, the official “Patch 0” still contain many bugs that it was originally intended to fix.

Obviously, Hellgate : London current build is still very unstable and not reliable, check out their official forum here:

http://forums.hellgatelondon.com/forumdisplay.php?f=25

Note: You can’t access the official Hellgate : London Forums unless you have a valid US / EU Hellgate : London cd-key or you were a beta tester back then.

To sum up what’s in that particular forum section, basically it contains 43 pages of 846 topics where players reported that their Hellgate : London game client suffered random freezes and crashes, i.e. anything else that seriously messes up your gaming experience.

I wonder how does one enjoy their gaming session if it is constantly plagued by random freezes, crashes and all sorts of gaming breaking issues?

Guild Wars – I experienced a very smooth launch back in May 2005 when I first played Guild Wars, no major bugs experienced for myself. The game engine and net code is very optimized, the game even played out very smoothly on my ancient rig! I was a using a Pentium 4 1.5Ghz, 512MB PC133Mhz RAM and a nvidia Geforce 4200Ti back then.

Absolutely no server down times when they updated their build, when you connect your client to their server, it will automatically download all the files and decompress all the files that your client is required to run the game. The only real downtime I encountered was only once, when they have to do some database maintenance or something like that.

Well, it is time to announce the winner of this round, which is Guild Wars, of course.
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Round 10 : Environment, Explorable Areas, Towns, Outposts, etc
(Back to the list)

Hellgate : London – Randomly generated areas to give you an unique experience every time! Infinite re-playability! Sounds good, right? However, after going through a few rounds, I discovered that there are only a few tile sets that keeps repeating itself. You will find yourself constantly wading through corridors, sewers, streets, hell rifts, etc and after some time, you find all of them extremely repetitive. Even all the stations look and feel similar, well, after all, they are in fact – underground stations.

Guild Wars – Beautifully rendered landscapes, towns, outposts, explorable areas, etc. None of those randomly generated crap that is plentiful in Hellgate : London.

Okay, this marks the 10 consecutive wins for Guild Wars.

Like so we’ve seen how the reviews, business model, multiplayer, PvP, skills, respecs, inventory, emotes, stability and environment of a 2+ years old game like Guild Wars beat the hell out of Hellgate : London, which is a new game released a week ago.

We can go further with this but why bother? Hellgate : London has taken enough of a beating for one article.

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[poll=2]

Where do you stand?

Would you join the ranks of Guild Wars supporters and proceed to stomp Hellgate : London into the ground?

Or would you rather take up the challenge and speak out for Hellgate : London?

Have any new ideas to contribute to this epic showdown? Do feel free to voice out!


48 Comments

  1. 16th November 2007 
    4:04 pm         

    Cabby
    said the following:

    ๐Ÿ˜†
    1. What do you have to pay for the “Expansions” in Guild Wars? -> it’s nearly the same price as subscribing for HG:L.
    2. Atmosphere – GW looked funny, in HG:L it is a real dark atmopshere
    3. What was GW in the first month?
    4. You can’t compare a game that is over a year old with a game that’s just launched… If you take a look on the first months of WoW … OMG … by now it’s the most played online-rpg..

    I like GW, but i don’t like articles like this. It’s like comparing driving-games … in Formula 1 Grand Prix you can drive 300mph, in NFSU you can drive 200mph… the grafics are better in one game and so on … but at the end Formula 1 Fans will play the F1GP and Modding-Fans will play the other game….
    cheers, cabby

  2. 16th November 2007 
    4:34 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @ Cabby

    ๐Ÿ˜†

    Cheers, mate. Thanks for the comment. :mrgreen:

    1. I paid much, probably more than the amount for the USD149.99 Founders Offer, as I own:
    x2 Guild Wars : Prophesies (1 digital copy, 1 box copy)
    x2 Guild Wars : Factions (1 digital copy, 1 box copy)
    x1 Guild Wars : Nightfall (1 box copy)
    x2 Guild Wars : Eye of the North (1 digital copy, 1 box copy)
    x2 Character Slots @ USD9.99 each
    x1 Game of the Year Upgrade @ less than USD10 can’t remember amount

    You correct, it is almost the same as subscribing to Hellgate : London, but the problem is that, if I don’t go for the Founders Offer at USD149.99 and instead choose to subscribe monthly at USD9.99, I am basically “renting” the game’s so called “new content”.

    For Guild Wars, it is purchased new content, not rented.

    2. Well, yeah. 2 totally different settings, one is somewhat typical medieval fantasy, the other a bleak futuristic dark ages post apocalyptic setting.

    3. As far as I can remember, the gaming experience for me was very smooth, I have not experienced one single crash from it, at that time, the graphics are beautiful and my ancient rig is capable of running it without any issues.

    http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Game_updates/2005_May#Update_-_Sunday.2C_May_01_2005

    If you check out the game updates logs, you will notice that ArenaNet is much more frequent with the updates.

    Plus, they do not need to “shut down” the server when they update the server with a new build. In game players are informed that a new build is available, and they just need to log out and re-connect to the server, and the auto updating process begins. Downtime due to patching is zero percent.

    4. True, but I am not using the current build of Guild Wars for this comparison. If you noticed the notes that I wrote before I start the “10 rounds”, i.e.

    “Note: Guild Warsโ€™ initial retail launch build back in 26 April 2005 is used for this comparison, it is only fair to compare initial retail launch builds against one another.”

    Personally, I detest and avoid online games that requires a monthly subscription so I can’t really comment on World of Warcraft (WOW).

    Hellgate : London, on the other hand, offers an “optional” monthly subscription. So I probably be playing the “basic” non-subscription version of Hellgate : London until Flagship Studios offers an alternative business model.

    Aye, I am comparing these 2 games as they share many similarities, i.e.
    1. Instanced explorable / combat zones
    2. Instanced stations / outposts / towns
    3. Both companies founded by former employees of Blizzard

    Hellgate : London would probably have “better” graphics as the game engine used to render the 3D graphics, hence I did not compare the graphics of these 2 games.

    Technologically wise, Hellgate : London would have better graphics, i.e. DX10 and stuff.

    Artistically wise, I would say Guild Wars is more beautiful.

    Anyway, the point that I am trying to prove in this article is that:

    Whatever Hellgate : London is trying to achieve during its initial launch, Guild Wars simply did better 2 years ago.

    Cheers!

    :mrgreen:

  3. 19th November 2007 
    6:29 am         

    Hob
    said the following:

    While the “rounds” are a bit biased, after all there are a lot of ways to compare these two games, it doesn’t make the pionts made any less valid.

    For Hellgate: London, the fact of the matter is:

    -the business model is terrible, forcing people to pay monthly fees for features that are often considered free by the rest of the industry, and leaving the non-payers with a bargin-bin game.

    -multiplayer takes online games back a decade instead of using the knowledge of current multiplayer games to their advantage. Though, if you have problems socializing with more than 5 people at one time, then maybe you don’t care. ๐Ÿ˜†

    -very little thought was given to the skill system. Lack of skills, skill points, respecs, and inner class diversity suggests that this is not a part of the game that the developers want people to enjoy. “Just equip gear with the biggest numbers and click the mouse wildly”. When more than 3/4 of the player base is begging for some sort of skill and attribute redistribution system and the devs just lock and/or ignore topics on the matter, it goes to show how little they care.

    -the inventory system is a joke, plan and simple. How is it that a game released in 1999 allowed me to carry over 100 items, yet 8 years later this game allows for about a dozen items?

    -the game client is barely suitable for open beta testing. I could go on for days about all the bugs in this game. It is simply unacceptable to release a game with as many problems as this game has. Instances generated lacking required quest elements, impassible barriers, or no exit portals. Many skills provide little benefit to their class, scale horribly past the first skill level, or are broken all together. Credit cards being incorrectly billed many times due to the amateurly created ecommerce site. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    -as of launch the game is nothing more than a slighty better version of Dungeon Runners (which quite possibly may be the worst action RPG game I’ve ever played) with a hefty price tag.

    -they deserve the shitty reviews that they are getting. Until they realize that ripping off people is not the way to run a successful game, I’ll do my best to help prevent people from making the same horrible mistake I made, buying this game.

  4. 23rd November 2007 
    4:45 pm         

    Enthralled
    said the following:

    I know this is a tiny thing, but for some reason for me it is a big deal.

    HG:L – Full 3d environment, you can jump, you can fall, etc
    GW – 3d environment but 2d movement

    For whatever reason the interactions with the world in GW feels very fake to me. The stupidity of not being able to go over a tiny drop drove me nuts. I could not stand the way the maps forced me to follow a given path. I will grant that the maps of GW were much larger, but I felt more constrained because of the very illusion of openness. I know I am probably one of the few people bugged by this, but it seriously drives me crazy.

    As far as the skill system, correct me if I am remembering this wrong (been a few years) but with GW you were forced to pick only a few skills out of your total that you could have access to at one time. While in HG:L you can use any of your skills. To be a fair comparison you need to point that out I think.

    Of course it also should be mentioned that the gameplay of both games is nothing alike. Those who enjoy a FPS style game will like HG:L more than GW. It is hard to figure out any kind of objective comparison between the two types of gameplay, but some people will just not like one or the other ignoring all other benefits/problems.

    Finally I think it is also only fair to compare the ability to solo. When GW first came out I was only able to solo the very first few areas. After a while I was forced to either party, or try to deal with brain dead AI party members to advance. Things might have changed in GW now, but at launch it was not a solo friendly game. HG:L is very solo friendly (perhaps too solo friendly for an online game but still..).

  5. 24th November 2007 
    9:27 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @Hob:

    ๐Ÿ˜› These rounds are meant to be in favor of Guild Wars. Yeah, all the above points are pretty valid though biased.

    Hell yeah, their business model is certainly not appealing. Definitely not worthy of a monthly subscription, in my opinion. Whatever they are attempting to achieve, Guild Wars already achieved it more than 2 years ago in their initial launch.

    6 max players per instance does sounds kinda limited, aye? ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    Personally, I feel that respecs ought to the norm for nowadays online games that involves attributes and skills. Gaming developers ought to realize that many gamers have grown up and are working adults now, who has not much time to spend on games as they used to when they were still young.

    Regarding the Hellgate : London Inventory System, I think they missed Diablo 2’s Inventory System too much.
    ๐Ÿ˜›

    Plagued by a plethora of bugs as described by SomeThingAwful.com, aye. I can’t believe how the horde of beta players survived through the months of alpha and beta testing?

    Didn’t get to play Dungeon Runners much myself, downloaded it, installed it, ran it. Found out it was too laggy for me to enjoy it throughly, so I un-installed it. For us South East Asian Hellgate : London players, we basically paid to beta test their server. The server was still running pre-Patch 0 beta build, only updated to Patch 0.1 recently and introduced a whole lot more bugs. Note that the current patch version for US / EU servers is Patch 0.5

    Critics review the game based on the state that the game is released in, so if the game is in a terrible shape during its initial retail launch then a tsunami of terrible reviews should be expected.
    ____________________________________________

    @Enthralled:

    Yeah, I am aware that Guild Wars is not exactly 3D, i.e. no Z-axis. So I think this is one of the main reasons that ArenaNet kinda “abandoned” Guild Wars 1 and is working hard at developing Guild Wars 2. I think they received too many complaints from the player community about this “not able to jump over a small rock” issue. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Hopefully, Guild Wars 2 with the Z-Axis introduced in, we would not have this kind of problems that you mentioned again.

    You are correct, as Guild Wars only permits players to choose 8 skills to put into their skill bar which only consists of 8 skill slots. Aw you got me with this one, I was hoping no one would notice it. ๐Ÿ™„ This would be Round 11 then.

    Aye, we can only compare apple to apple, orange to orange, hence I picked out the various fruits in Hellgate : London and Guild Wars to compare them against one another. It is true that fans of a certain genre would love a game and ignore some of its shortcomings, however in the case of Hellgate : London, I find it quite hard to ignore the gaming breaking bugs such as random server disconnects, random crashes to desktops etc.

    Ah! The ability to play the game by yourself, i.e. solo friendly. You got me again! All rights, this would be Round 12 then. You are correct, Guild Wars was not exactly very “solo friendly” during its initial launch more than 2 years ago way back in April 2005. Still, the game is playable with henchmen. Except that for the later stages, grouping up with other human players is required. Guild Wars is “solo friendly” with the introduction of “Heroes” in Guild Wars: Nightfall, but since we are comparing initial release builds so this don’t count. ๐Ÿ˜‰ Yeah, in fact I think Hellgate : London is way too solo friendly. I mean, the mobs get way much harder if you play in a group instead of playing with yourself. The rewards in terms of loot drops is worth the trouble though.
    ____________________________________________

    Cheers to Hob and Enthralled for sharing your opinions!
    :mrgreen:

    @Enthralled:
    I’ll work on Round 11 and Round 12 soon. ๐Ÿ˜ˆ

  6. 25th November 2007 
    6:18 am         

    bob
    said the following:

    I really don’t see the point of this at all.

    Your comparing two games that aren’t really even the similar.

    It’d be like me comparing your face to my arse (not an insult..humor)

    Round one both are funny looking but my arse smells better. =D

    I have played both games. GW was PvP bugged after launch and it was really easy (which I am not opposed to easy play) to level in. I got bored quick.

    Replay value of that owned property you talk of, to me was… I have never gone back to it after 3 weeks of play.

    HG:L its been a almost a month now and I am seriously considering playing the same class but a different build. That speaks volumes as far as replay value goes.

    HG:L is only $10 a month, or if one is lucky enough to become a founder (lucky as in has the up front money within the time limit set to become one) most online games are $15. I am saving $ as far as I am concerned.

    I will give ya GW was stunning graphics and w/o need of a uber rig to view it..but same time HG:L’s .5 patch did help me in regards to set my visual settings higher and really be able to enjoy the graphics at hand. If I wasn’t running a dinosaur of a rig I should think I would be in awe of what the top settings would be like. I don’t mind being at medium settings..it looks great imho.

  7. 26th November 2007 
    4:56 pm         

    tazar
    said the following:

    I dunno about you guys, but I soloed through all GW campaigns and eye of the north.
    OK, with help from henchmen and heroes.

    GW is a no-frills do-what-its-meant-to-be kind of game. Click enemy, auto attack, click on ground, move there. No funny techniques like jumping or ducking that don’t contribute to the objectives.

    I’m a little worried when they say GW2 will remove click-to-move, and add jumping, if they go the way of tedious MMORPGs, then I’ll move on to other games.

  8. 27th November 2007 
    7:18 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @bob:

    Aye, the whole point is to prove that Guild Wars did much better in their initial launch 2 years ago and they did not offer to charge the players an optional monthly fee.

    Actually, these two (2) games are quite similar, in a certain sense. For starters, both games relies heavily on instance.

    Duh! No offense taken, mate. Actually, faces should be compared against faces, arses compared against arses.

    Well, Guild Wars ain’t one hundred percent bug free during its initial launch, but it certainly ain’t so bug ridden like Hellgate : London is right now. And when it comes to squashing bugs, ArenaNET squashed them much faster.

    To each their own, I say. Guild Wars is simply not your cup of tea, as I have been playing Guild Wars from 2005 until now, though I spend much less time on it nowadays.

    As for Hellgate : London, I stopped playing it for good after IAHGames patched the server to Patch 0.1. The loading times seems to be significant longer, and more bugs seems to have bee introduced into the game instead of fixed.

    The optional monthly subscription that Hellgate : London is offering is simply not worth it, as analyzed in this article here:
    http://ahkong.net/is-hgl-worthy-of-the-subscription/

    Aye, Guild Wars was released in 2005 while Hellgate : London was released in 2007. In terms of technically advanced graphics, Hellgate : London must be better than Guild Wars, or else I really dunno what to say. However, I must comment that Hellgate : London did a very messy job at optimizing their game engine, graphics engine etc. If they have done a proper job at start, I believe there would no cases of memory leaks or whatsoever. I certainly do not recall any incidents of memory leaks in Guild Wars.

    Yeah, Hellgate : London looks awesome, I totally agree with you on that. In fact, the first time I ran the Hellgate : London Beta, I had all settings blasted up to the max, and it was sweet! (I am using DX 9 btw) However, it also killed my RAM:
    http://ahkong.net/help/
    _______________________________________________________

    @tazar:

    Yeah, same here mate. However, for prophesies I had some help from the good strangers I met in public games and my guild mates. Factions, I completed with Henchies alone. Nightfall and Eye of the North, I completed with Heroes and Henchies.

    Aye, true. Jumping around in Hellgate : London caused my character to get stuck in a bus. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    Perhaps the old method of controlling our characters would still be retained? I mean like, we are still able to click and command our characters to move here and there etc.

    Cheers! ๐Ÿ˜€

  9. 28th November 2007 
    12:52 am         

    ProjectGSX
    said the following:

    I recently quit Guild Wars to play Hellgate.

    Guild Wars is, by far, the better game. However, Ive played it for the last two years and want to do something new for a bit. I highly doubt Ill stick with HGL for 2 years as the game play is very, very shallow. Its a nice change of pace, though.

  10. 28th November 2007 
    8:12 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @ProjectGSX:

    Aye, I feel the same about both games – Guild Wars and Hellgate : London, though I stopped playing Hellgate : London recently. โžก

    Hordes of game breaking bugs and issues prevented me from further enjoying Hellgate : London. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    Taking a break off Hellgate : London until future patches properly fixes it for good. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    Cheers!

  11. 4th December 2007 
    10:52 am         

    Taufoo
    said the following:

    *off topic*
    hey guys, was wondering wad will people do if they hate both games n wanna vote?
    So can i request for the vote “zomg,i hate both GW n HGL, they suck arse”

    kthxbye

  12. 4th December 2007 
    11:04 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @Taufoo:
    ๐Ÿ˜† Pardon me, it seems that I left out that particular option. Gimme a minute yarrrr. Hooookay! Request granted. Have fun, mate.

    Cheers! ๐Ÿ˜Ž

  13. 6th December 2007 
    12:49 pm         

    Lodz
    said the following:

    Thank God you do not write for a legitimate website or column. Going into what some would refer to as a “comparison” with a total bias is a sin against those with independent thought. Way to only pick apart the faults of a single game while praising the other shamelessly! You are a shining beacon of what brain-dead “bloggers” strive to become. You failed to mention storyline… in my experience a game is nothing but a waist of time if there is no worthwhile setting/storyline. What Guild Wars lacked in storyline it surly made up for in “hands-off” gameplay and weak character system. Just because you may be cheap and don’t want to shell out $15 a month for Final Fantasy XI, you would rather waist your time with a half assed clone. Dust off your wallet and try a worthwhile RPG for once. I could go on all night but continuing an argument that will probably fall upon deaf ears. Just remember, there is a reason Guild Wars was free… No one would be willing to pay monthly for it!

  14. 6th December 2007 
    2:40 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    Lodz:

    Thank God you do not write for a legitimate website or column.

    Yes, thank goodness I don’t write for them. :mrgreen:

    Going into what some would refer to as a โ€œcomparisonโ€ with a total bias is a sin against those with independent thought.

    To each their own, mate. It is still a comparison, none the less. โžก

    Way to only pick apart the faults of a single game while praising the other shamelessly!

    The fact still remains that one game is full of faults while the other had little to none. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    You are a shining beacon of what brain-dead โ€œbloggersโ€ strive to become.

    That is not a polite thing to say, but everyone has the right of freedom of speech. ๐Ÿ™„

    You failed to mention storylineโ€ฆ in my experience a game is nothing but a waist of time if there is no worthwhile setting/storyline. What Guild Wars lacked in storyline it surly made up for in โ€œhands-offโ€ gameplay and weak character system.

    Personally, I feel that Guild War’s story is far more superior than Hellgate : London. ๐Ÿ˜ˆ

    In fact, Guild War’s gameplay and character system is much more robust than Hellgate : London’s repetitive gameplay and mediocre character system. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Again, to each their own, mate.
    “Beauty is in the eye of the Beholder.”
    “One man’s passed-motion is another’s moolah.”

    Just because you may be cheap and donโ€™t want to shell out $15 a month for Final Fantasy XI, you would rather waist your time with a half assed clone.

    I would not use the word “cheap” here, economically wise is a far more better word. I choose not to waste my precious time on all those MMORPGs even though I can afford to subscribe and play them. ๐Ÿ’ก

    Dust off your wallet and try a worthwhile RPG for once. I could go on all night but continuing an argument that will probably fall upon deaf ears.

    In the past I have played various PC RPGs such as the Baldur’s Gate series, Fallout series, Planescape : Torment, Elder Scrolls series etc. Just to name a few, and I would not consider Hellgate : London to be a “worth while” RPG. ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    Just remember, there is a reason Guild Wars was freeโ€ฆ No one would be willing to pay monthly for it!

    Guild Wars is free because ArenaNet believes in non-subscription online gaming, and they succeeded in realizing it. :mrgreen:

    Of course no one would be willing to pay a monthly fee for it since there would never ever be a monthly fee for it. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    Oh by the way, thanks for the feedback yo.
    It is much appreciated!
    Cheers! ๐Ÿ˜†

  15. 7th December 2007 
    4:24 am         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    It sad to say……I agree with Deimos. โžก

    I love hellgate. but I think I have to wait untill they update more. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    I’m GW player too….and I play all 4 ep like deimos. (but I’m didn’t buy Extra slot ๐Ÿ˜€ )

    It’s ture….we can’t compare both game together….but think in other way….Flagship already have example…they should know what they should do?? to make player happy and want to pay….I hope they do. ๐Ÿ™„

    BTW…..That SEA is mean “South East Asian”?? I thought it mean “Server Error All the time” (I play in this server) ๐Ÿ˜†

  16. 7th December 2007 
    10:23 am         

    Amadox
    said the following:

    those games are honestly not comparable. (i own and love both, i know what i am talking off). GW is a MMORPG, HGL is not. HGL follows the ways of Diablo2, as an Action RPG, not an MMO. Thats why there aren’t a thousand skills, but only a selected few (the variation is given trough items, which differ FAR more then in GW, which wasn’t mentioned here anywhere.. ^), and thats why there are only smaller groups YET.

    Additionally: this comparison was MADE to make GW win, this isn’t a fair review… And even if you wrote you’d compare with GW at its release, you often threw in facts about GW as its NOW, not back then (increased inventory, for example, or group sizes..)

    Hellgate was in fact released some month to early, but seeing how it develops, i’m pretty sure, it will be as big or bigger as GW now, when its in the same age..

  17. 8th December 2007 
    3:22 pm         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    You left out one more round: Minions.

    The under-appreciated minions of Guild Wars were more varied, you KNEW what they did, they were better at their job than the Engineer’s and Summoner’s, and you could do it on one char, if you wanted to. Oh, and minion heals were more varied and effective, too.

    Let’s hear it for our Little Helpers, minions!

  18. 8th December 2007 
    6:27 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @JJ PornoGraphy:

    It sad to sayโ€ฆโ€ฆI agree with Deimos. โžก

    Finally, there is another one who agrees with me! :mrgreen:

    I love hellgate. but I think I have to wait untill they update more. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    I admit that I was deeply impressed by the full motion video introduction of Hellgate : London, as well as the first time when I launched the Hellgate : London beta. โ—

    But after all the initial goodness fuzzy woozy feeling subsided, the various game breaking bugs kicked in, totally ruining my gaming experience. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    So hell yeah, I stopped playing and is waiting for the various upcoming patches to squash all the bugs. ๐Ÿ™‚

    Iโ€™m GW player tooโ€ฆ.and I play all 4 ep like deimos. (but Iโ€™m didnโ€™t buy Extra slot ๐Ÿ˜€ )

    High-Five! Fellow Guild Wars player! Well, the reason I bought some extra slots is that I could qualify for the Bonus Mission Pack, and yes the Bonus Mission Pack rocks! ๐Ÿ˜€

    Itโ€™s tureโ€ฆ.we canโ€™t compare both game togetherโ€ฆ.but think in other wayโ€ฆ.Flagship already have exampleโ€ฆthey should know what they should do?? to make player happy and want to payโ€ฆ.I hope they do. ๐Ÿ™„

    Well, the point of this whole versus battle thingie is meant to be a Hellgate : London bashing spree. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Still, there exist people who would still gladly support Flagship Studios through Founders Offer subscription or the normal monthly subscriptions. ๐Ÿ˜

    Perhaps, Flagship Studios are targeting these group of players? ๐Ÿ™„

    BTWโ€ฆ..That SEA is mean โ€œSouth East Asianโ€?? I thought it mean โ€œServer Error All the timeโ€ (I play in this server) ๐Ÿ˜†

    Oh my goodness! SEA stands for “Server Error All the time” oh you just cracked me up, this is a good one! Perhaps a better one would be “Server Error Always” ๐Ÿ˜†
    _________________________________________________________

    @Amadox:

    those games are honestly not comparable. (i own and love both, i know what i am talking off).

    Glad to find a fellow player who owns, plays and love both games! ๐Ÿ™‚

    GW is a MMORPG, HGL is not.

    Actually, both possess some traits of “Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game”. Let’s take a look ya?

    1. Able to interact with many people online
    (Massively Multiplayer Online)

    2. You play a role of a nobody at start, but turn out to be a hero in the end.
    (Role Playing Game)

    Can I disagree with your statement here? ๐Ÿ˜›

    HGL follows the ways of Diablo2, as an Action RPG, not an MMO.

    Agreed. It is pretty much an extremely buggy futuristic Diablo 2. But it is still considered as “Masssively Multiplayer Online” since the option to be able to interact with massive amount of players is still there. ๐Ÿ™„

    Thats why there arenโ€™t a thousand skills, but only a selected few (the variation is given trough items, which differ FAR more then in GW, which wasnโ€™t mentioned here anywhere.. ^), and thats why there are only smaller groups YET.

    Nonetheless, that round is a comparison of number of skills, hence the winner is Guild Wars, of course. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Regarding items, the item stats for Guild Wars are kinda fixed due to PvP balance, so the outcome of the battle is heavily influenced by what skills we use instead of what thingies we are equipped with. ๐Ÿ™„

    However, there are many different skins for the items in Guild Wars, yes I am talking about the original prophesies release. I would have to do a through research to find out which game has a large selection of item skins. ๐Ÿ˜•

    Additionally: this comparison was MADE to make GW win, this isnโ€™t a fair reviewโ€ฆ And even if you wrote youโ€™d compare with GW at its release, you often threw in facts about GW as its NOW, not back then (increased inventory, for example, or group sizes..)

    Glad that you noticed that. ๐Ÿ˜› Though I did throw in facts about the present, Guild Wars still win those rounds because of how it was in the past. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    Hellgate was in fact released some month to early, but seeing how it develops, iโ€™m pretty sure, it will be as big or bigger as GW now, when its in the same age..

    Let us all cross our fingers for that to happen, shall we? One of the reasons for this article to be developed and published in this manner was to send a crystal clear message to Flagship Studios telling them that Hellgate : London could be much more better game.
    _________________________________________________________

    @Soy Oil:

    You left out one more round: Minions.

    Duh! Minions. Yeah! I forgot about those cute little buggers. ๐Ÿ˜ณ

    The under-appreciated minions of Guild Wars were more varied, you KNEW what they did, they were better at their job than the Engineerโ€™s and Summonerโ€™s, and you could do it on one char, if you wanted to. Oh, and minion heals were more varied and effective, too.

    Letโ€™s hear it for our Little Helpers, minions!

    Hmmm… Necromancer’s Minions and the Ranger’s Pet.

    Rangers can only have one pet at a time, but there are many different types of tamable pets in the original prophesies.

    Necromancers can animate Bone Horrors, Bone Fiends and Bone Minions in Guild Wars : Prophesies and there are quite a number of spells designed to heal and manipulate these Minions.

    As for Hellgate : London, I have only tried out the Hunter Engineer class to some extent (only leveled to level 23) and have yet to really try out the other classes. So you don’t seem me exactly comparing the classes of these 2 games since I am lacking knowledge in those areas. โžก

    Perhaps you would like to share some knowledge with me here? ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Cheers! ๐Ÿ˜€

  19. 9th December 2007 
    7:01 am         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    Wait!!!! u already got the Bonus Mission Pack?? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    I should get them too (I order GW:EN box for in-store shop)

    It’s a packet?? or they just upgrade ur ID??

    If They upgrade ID….how can I check it?? can u tell me??

    but If It’s a packet…that is a sad thing. becuase I order GW:EN at the release day….untill now that packet still not show up. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    but thank god….when I report they.(ArenaNet) they fix this problem by upgrade my ID. ๐Ÿ˜›

    all the thing i have to do next is wait for my packet arrive….and I hope I can get it before GW2 release. ๐Ÿ˜†

  20. 9th December 2007 
    7:42 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    Wait!!!! u already got the Bonus Mission Pack?? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    Yeah. I got mine. They activated it recently. ๐Ÿ™‚

    I should get them too (I order GW:EN box for in-store shop)

    What is “in-store shop”? Did you mean the Guild Wars Online Store? ๐Ÿ˜•

    Itโ€™s a packet?? or they just upgrade ur ID??

    It is not available for sale as a retail box copy, they just upgrade our game account (ID) and we would have access to the bonus missions. :mrgreen:

    The Guild Wars BMP was made available on November 29, 2007 to all accounts that spent $29 USD (โ‚ฌ26/ยฃ17) or more in the Official Guild Wars (online) Store between July 5, 2007 and October 31, 2007. This promotion was limited to once per account. The Guild Wars Mission Pack is not transferable and was only available to the exact account that fulfilled the criteria of this promotion.

    Source
    http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Bonus_Mission_Pack

    Did you spend USD 29 or more in the Guild Wars Online store? ๐Ÿ˜

    If They upgrade IDโ€ฆ.how can I check it?? can u tell me??

    Sure thing, mate. ๐Ÿ˜Ž
    1. At the character selection screen after you logged in
    2. Check out the bottom left corner of the screen
    3. Click the Eedit Account button
    4. Click the check box next to Manage Access Keys
    5. Check out the bottom right corner of the screen
    6. Click the green “Next >” button
    7. Check and see if you have Guild Wars Mission Pack in the list

    but If Itโ€™s a packetโ€ฆthat is a sad thing. becuase I order GW:EN at the release dayโ€ฆ.untill now that packet still not show up. ๐Ÿ˜ก

    What’s a “packet”? Are you referring to a physical retail game box? ๐Ÿ˜•

    but thank godโ€ฆ.when I report they.(ArenaNet) they fix this problem by upgrade my ID. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Oh. Okay. Glad to hear that ArenaNet responded to your problem. :mrgreen:

    all the thing i have to do next is wait for my packet arriveโ€ฆ.and I hope I can get it before GW2 release. ๐Ÿ˜†

    Hope you get your Bonus Mission Pack soon yo! ๐Ÿ˜€

    By the way, what is your in-game-name aye? Perhaps we might be able to meet up in the game one day. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Mine is “Deimos Tel Arin” ๐Ÿ˜‰

    If you are interested, you can check out some screenies that I posted over here:
    http://ahkong.net/guild-wars-bonus-mission-pack/

    Cheer! ๐Ÿ˜€

  21. 9th December 2007 
    12:32 pm         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    Oh, sure. In GW: Factions, the Ritualist can summon Spirits: stationary ghosts who either have some sort of AOE buff, or act like turrets, shooting either enemies or allies for various effects. Necromancers also gained the Flesh Golem(tank) and Vampiric Horror(health drain). Nightfall added the Shambling Horror, which when killed, becomes a Jagged Horror (Bleeding condition). As you can figure, the Fiend is still the master of DPS. The real twist is when, due to Soul Reaping nerfs, the Rit/N Minion Bomber is the BETTER Minion Master. Boon of Creation, Animate Bone Minions, and Death Nova feature prominently. Blood of the Master, a Necro spell, heals all allied minions, not just the ones you control.

    Summoners are kind of like Necromancers who summon Elementalists. All Summoner pets do not require corpses. They can have one “Main pet,” properly called Minion, and as many “Elemental” pets as their Energy Bar can hold. Each Elemental pet (Fire, Toxic, Earth, Spectral, or Lightning) and each Minion (Carnagor for Tank, Witch Doctor for Heals, Warper for DPS) has their own specialty, and reduces your maximum Energy Pool by their Summon cost. Though frail, Minions and Elementals do not suffer degen, and can be healed by Brom’s Curse or a Witch Doctor, though it cannot heal itself, can be healed by Blood Link. Thus, many Summoners choose to invest heavily in Willpower and Elemental Mastery, to increase the maximum minions they can have, and still have enough to cast spells.

    Brom’s Curse heals anyone who attacks marked enemies, and the Witch Doctor heals anyone they target with their healing beam spell, Elemental or Party Member alike. More points in WD increases their healing frequency, and Hand of Nostrum multiplies how many beams they have.

    Fire, and Storm Elementals have a ranged attack, Earths go melee and are pretty good mini-tanks, and Spectrals have an melee-AOE attack. Toxics have a ranged attack that splashes slightly. Except for Earth/Force Elementals, they are all very frail and go down in one hit, so a single strong AOE attack wipes them all out, making Boss fights more about attrition than attributes.

    For more information on Hellgate, though not much:
    http://hellgate.incgamers.com/w/index.php/Summoner_Skills

    Any other GW info past Prophesies here: http://wiki.guildwars.com/

  22. 9th December 2007 
    1:14 pm         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    But if you’re just comparing at-release, Hand of Nostrum was broken, nobody could agree on what Summoning Circle did, and figuring out what the various Elementals and Minions did was largely trial-and-error.

    Oh, and sorry about all the Factions and up stuff. XP

  23. 9th December 2007 
    3:30 pm         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    I totally forgot about this, earlier. In Prophesies, the old version of Verata’s Sacrifice, Blood of the Master, and Heal Area meant you could have upwards of 30 minions, and pros could maintain 100+. Too bad they capped it at 10 when Factions released. It was still hilarious.

  24. 9th December 2007 
    3:34 pm         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    My point is, a lvl 30 Summoner can reasonably maintain 6-10 minions, more if he has +skills and +Will stuff, while a Prophesies Necro can have tons. Ok, enough dominating the thread…

  25. 9th December 2007 
    10:29 pm         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    Oh crap!!! I didn’t see it….I already got them. ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    Oh…..and my in-game-name is “MayHa Da Soulkeeper” for Main Char or “Mayha Da ********”(depend with class) for sub Char(play for get skills for my hero)…..and I walk around Euro-English server. ๐Ÿ™„

    BTW why NPC price for Guild hall is so expensive. ๐Ÿ˜•

  26. 10th December 2007 
    12:43 am         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    other thing I still not like it in HGL. is the summoner have to keep put points to will power If they want to use more Elementals.

    and it make problem for some people(including me) who want to use guns to cover my minnion & elementals(including my own ass ๐Ÿ˜† ).becuase we have to put point to str & acc for holding guns. ๐Ÿ˜•

    It make me to manage my limit of elementals number.

  27. 10th December 2007 
    12:10 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @Soy Oil:
    Whoah! ๐Ÿ˜
    Thanks for the comprehensive feedback, mate. ๐Ÿ™‚
    Much appreciated yo! ๐Ÿ˜‰
    Though I much about the history of Guild Wars, other readers may not be. Mighty thanks for sharing such detailed information aye! :mrgreen:
    Basically, Guild Wars wins the round of “Minions” by the total amount of minions maintained and controlled, right? ๐Ÿ˜‰

    @JJ PornoGraphy:
    Oh, you have access to the Guild Wars Bonus Mission Pack already? Awesome! ๐Ÿ˜Ž
    So you play on the European servers aye? I myself reside on the American servers. ๐Ÿ˜ˆ
    The NPC price for the Guild Halls are indeed expensive, aye. Gold sink mah, what to do? โžก
    Indeed, for Hellgate : London the Summoner’s willpower determine the maximum amount of minions and elementals controllable. ๐Ÿ˜•

  28. 11th December 2007 
    12:13 am         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    Maintained, controlled, durability, and total DPS. And they can actually be differentiated by color-blind people, cuz they all look and act differently. So yeah. They win by a skeleton landslide.

  29. 11th December 2007 
    12:36 am         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    WTF? You do the Gravatar thing? I did not know this. Shamusyoung got me started this morning.

    It’s my Elf eating a donut, if you can’t tell.

  30. 11th December 2007 
    1:06 pm         

    Skoder
    said the following:

    I WoW for 2 years… I read books on Warcraft. They have very nice story line like Thrall of the Horde written by Christie Golden. In terms of graphics, game play, storyline, Wow pretty much has it all. However, PVE content really depends very much on the size and the quality of the raiders.

    This is the part where HG shines. U can very much solo the whole way and have epics/legendaries or in this case uniques without conjuring 25 man with the rite class online, let alone their quality in wow(means ppl decked in crappy gears and barely know howda play their class)

    I m stepping outta Wow for a breather atm for HG ^^.

    However, I have to agree with the starter of this post even in a WOW hardcore perspective.

    1) Wow is MMO , HG isnt… HG is more like MO ( multiplayer online, not Massive… U can say its RPG with an online multiplayer option. Why? Cos u can barely see 50 potatoes online…

    2) I am tired of paying $600 a year for the 2 Wow accounts. And for HG, i wont pay even penny for their coming fixes.. (not patches)

    3) No re-spec? u gotta be kidding. Every skills gotta be an edge or purpose, we put pts there to try out, instead of checking forums and listening to ppl cursing its useless wasting skill/attributes pts and is forced to reroll another toon.

    4) SEA…. With that kindda disappointing mistakes and errors during the launch, I can psycho myself to forgive. But the consistency in bugs and crashes is disturbing and disruptive to gameplay, let alone enjoying the game… So , further enforcing my pt. no.2.

    While I applaud at your coolness in handling Lodz perspective, i would like to add that I do again concur your facts stated are more true than bias.

    I am very sadden and disappointed with HG atm. And I hope they can straighten up their thoughts and start to realise that one can charge subscription with good track records, outstanding game and exciting coming patches. HG , imho, failed in all.

    PS: I played Diablo ALL the WAY till D2 was out. Bought the latter expansion and continued till Wow came out. Only to break in between to catch some DOTA. ^^ I rather play D2, it has less bugs.

  31. 12th December 2007 
    9:22 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @Soy Oil:
    Aye, much thanks for the detailed feedback. :mrgreen:
    Now, I have to find the time to implement it. ๐Ÿ‘ฟ
    Yeah, I do the Gravatar thingie. ๐Ÿ˜€
    The pointy ears gave you away. ๐Ÿ™‚
    My avatar is myself. ๐Ÿ˜›

    @Skoder:
    Thanks for the feedback, mate. ๐Ÿ™‚
    I did not play World of Warcraft before so I am un-able to comment much on that. ๐Ÿ‘ฟ
    Thanks for the support. ๐Ÿ™‚
    Thanks for the applause. :mrgreen:
    Aye, I feel the same about Hellgate : London. Hence, the birth of this comparison. It is a message for the developers – Flagship Studios, telling them that they can do much better than this. ๐Ÿ™„
    Hell yeah! Diablo 2 is still fun! In fact I installed back Diablo 2 recently and tried out this totally cool Diablo 2 mod! ๐Ÿ˜ฎ
    http://ahkong.net/diablo-2-mod-eastern-sun/

    Cheers! ๐Ÿ˜€

  32. 15th December 2007 
    1:15 am         

    tmr819
    said the following:

    I enjoyed your “comparison” — very entertaining. Objective, balanced, fair-minded. Perfect! :mrgreen:

    I have been playing GW for a couple of years and still greatly enjoy it. HG:L really holds no interest for me (and, after reading your article, if possible even less than no interest now!), so I cannot comment on that game. I never had any intention of buying and/or subscribing to it, although I have been somewhat curious about it.

    Tabula Rasa, however, does interest me. So … I am looking forward to another even-handed, high-quality, and entertaining comparison by you: this time between TR and GW. ๐Ÿ˜‰

  33. 22nd December 2007 
    5:41 am         

    Kizza
    said the following:

    Hellgate London has a LOT of competition to try and beat and all those companies are completely loaded out the arse with money Flagship made a game based to real gamers who plan ahead (skill wise etc) and with improvements coming like technical ” raid ” bosses etc its still a growing game and will become extremely well accepted if people stopped comparing it to games like GW, i dont recall seeing a game recently that combined FPS with RPG and didn’t completely ruin the experience for FPS / RPG fans alike Sorry that your games are so e-z mode that u can completely ruin your build like a noob and not plan ahead so u get a free retard undo button Hellgate London is a quality game, it’s still being worked on heavily and will grow to be one of the best games out just be patient and stop trying to make it to be something it isn’t. If u can respec whats the point eventually you have 100 cookie cutters running around anyway.

  34. 22nd December 2007 
    6:41 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @tmr819:
    Glad to read that you enjoyed this article, aye. ๐Ÿ™‚
    However, I would not be able to compare Tabula Rasa against Guild Wars since Tabula Rasa is a game that requires monthly subscriptions and I don’t play games that requires monthly subscriptions. Plus, it does not feel right to compare those two (2) games since they are much different in nature. ๐Ÿ˜

    @Kizza:

    Hellgate London has a LOT of competition to try and beat and all those companies are completely loaded out the arse with money

    You are totally correct, mate. It is kinda sad but it is the cold hard fact. ๐Ÿ˜

    Flagship made a game based to real gamers who plan ahead (skill wise etc)

    Well, if you referring to the part of no respecs yet in Hellgate : London, then I would comment that Flagship Studios made a game for players who have way too much time to spend on a game. โžก

    and with improvements coming like technical โ€ raid โ€ bosses etc its still a growing game

    Time will tell whether these so called upcoming new content would redeem Hellgate : London and Flagship Studios or not. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    and will become extremely well accepted if people stopped comparing it to games like GW,

    Personally, comparing it to other games is not fair, but comparing it against the initial release build of Guild Wars is quite reasonable since they share many similarities. ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    i dont recall seeing a game recently that combined FPS with RPG and didnโ€™t completely ruin the experience for FPS / RPG fans alike

    You are right, I believe the last game to somewhat accomplish this feat is The Elder Scrolls : Oblivion? But that is several months ago and not “recently” aye. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Sorry that your games are so e-z mode that u can completely ruin your build like a noob and not plan ahead so u get a free retard undo button

    Sorry, mate. But these so called “e-z mode games” are what made games more appealing to casual gamers alike nowadays. Gamers who are working adults with steady income are more likely to subscribe to games, “normal” working adults gamers usually do not have that time to spend on games on a daily basis. Hence, this is where the “e-z mode games” comes in. ๐Ÿ˜ณ

    Hellgate London is a quality game, itโ€™s still being worked on heavily and will grow to be one of the best games out

    I thought it is a quality game too, but I was deeply disappointed by its mediocre release. Yes, it is still being worked on heavily, but I have yet to see any worth while results yet. Yes, hopefully, it would grow into one of the best games. ๐Ÿ™‚

    just be patient and stop trying to make it to be something it isnโ€™t.

    The fact is that Hellgate : London is trying hard to be everything else and failing miserably. ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    If u can respec whats the point eventually you have 100 cookie cutters running around anyway.

    If you can’t respec, then there would be only one (1) cookie cutter running around instead of one hundred (100) ๐Ÿ˜†

  35. 23rd December 2007 
    7:03 pm         

    nysilver
    said the following:

    That was a pretty GW fan rewiew. :mrgreen:
    I played D2,NWN,GW,WoW,D&D online,EQ2 and i have the HGL.
    GW a nice game but so limited:20 levels,8 skills/bar,few armor,weapon types.I wanna play a Dual wield warrior or a rogue with 2 sword/mace.Armors are terrible,you get higher protection the character getting more naked.Some class looks like just step it out from the Victoria Secrets catalog.Assassin skill combo is horrible, 1 of tham fails you have to star over,no stun and stealth ability.Gameplay is too short.About 2 days you can finish a character with all the elite skills,after 3 weeks the game get boring.After what? PvP,but what’s the point to do that.I got my rank 10 but no rewards.Other games gives
    ability to buy better gears.
    Anyway the idea from Anet is pretty good,I think GW2 will be much better.

    HGL…well i don’t know how the hell Bill Roper did some great games befor.Maybe some one in the Blizzard inspecting the projects,and said cut/put this in/out.LIke the guys who did WOW,they formerly games was not so popular.
    The whole world moving to MMO games,thats the future.
    Bill Roper think he cam make the same type of game after almost 8 years.5 dudes running together just not working anymore.

    I hope somedays ,some one gonna make a free WoW quality game.

  36. 24th December 2007 
    9:20 am         

    depresso
    said the following:

    One thing i have noticed is that you are comparing the entire game on the SEA server. You have only made slight references to the US/EU servers.

    I live in Australia, i connect to the US server with low ping and i have only EVER been disconnected from a server once and that was because they were doing weekly maintenance for an hour. And i knew this was happening ‘coz i got a message in game regarding this (granted the chat system needs work but either way).

    I have had minimal bugs, I have been stuck ONCE and that was on a bus – i jumped again and boosh! no more being stuck. I have been disconnected from the game once as i just stated and i have had only 1 crash (due to my gfx card overheating).

    Also there are more than 3 player slots for non-subscribers. I was a non-subscriber and i had 5 characters.

    Seems like you need to jump on a server which is more updated to fully appreciate it.

  37. 25th December 2007 
    2:37 am         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    @nysilver:

    what a reason for u to play GW?? high lv?? great equipment?? finnish the game in short time?? ๐Ÿ™„

    Let me tell u something…It’s sound cool when someone say they can finnish game that fast…but in other side…they just play to win with out enjoy the game. ๐Ÿ™„

    and with ur words…It’s make me wonder…u say “About 2 days you can finish a character with all the elite skills”…sorry If I misunderstand ur words?? but u say “with all the elite skills”

    Don’t tell me…u didn’t know about we can use only 1 elite skill in skill-bar?? ๐Ÿ™„

    or u mean…u can finnish game by collect all elite skills…in 2 days. ๐Ÿ˜ฎ

    and again…how u do that?? is a lots of them?? and a lot of money. ๐Ÿ˜•

    Don’t tell me…u didn’t know about we have to buy some signet to capture elite skill from mini boss…and it cost is 1k per signet…count for a one char…It’s around 30 elite skills…and signet cost should be around…30k!!! ๐Ÿ˜•

    Holy crape!!! how u can make that money in 2 days?? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ can u teach me?? โžก

    Maybe is just misunderstand becuase my poor eng. ๐Ÿ™„

    ok…back to topic again. ๐Ÿ˜›

    Max lv20…only 8 skill slots…not many special weapons & armor(in GW…a lot of special weapon is just look pretty but it have same ability with some u buy from shop…only some of them have special ability)

    Tell u the ture…at first I don’t like it too. but when I think about it carefully…I start like it. becuase it make player improve they’s play skill.

    when every one is stand in same lv…same equipment grade. Question is…how we can make a different?? :mrgreen:

    how we can deal with situation & survive with 8 skills?? don’t u think it’s a challenge??

    some skill is stupid(yes…u read right”stupid”) but when we use it with other skill…It become a cool combo.

    I play necro in GW…and I alway think about how to make a new build. and I alway spend in-game money to make it happan. (and it make me poor)

    I can play sub-tank role when party need one more tank…I can be nucker role when party need…I can be sub-heal role to help and support party…and all of this…I do it with necro skill. ๐Ÿ˜†

    but normaly…my role is nucker & heal area.

    and ture…Gw not have stun skill…but we have knock down.

    Assassin combo is good if u do it in a right way…this class is good for kill 1-1. in PVE this class is fine…but it PVP this class is great.

    and u right again…PVP mode is nothing. becuase the game name is “GUILD WARS” If u want to get a reward…go to GVG…and If ur guild win…ur victory is make effect for a whole server(ur regional server). ur server will get faver of god and they can get alot of special service(Only server who got faver of god can use this)…and If this is what u want…they have a cool & better gear in the list too. ๐Ÿ™„

    It have a lot of cool part in this game…if u try to find & enjoy with it…a quest…a story…and my favorite…the mini game. ๐Ÿ˜€

    tell u the ture…I stay at the town (in GW:EN) for a month for play mini game…I can tell u is f*cking fun. ๐Ÿ˜†

    plz try to play & enjoy the game. nysilver…even HGL it’s have a good part too. ๐Ÿ™‚

    but problem is….GW have that good part more then HGL.

    Oh…..BTW…Merry Christmas & Happy new year people. :mrgreen:

  38. 31st December 2007 
    3:36 am         

    Moregrim
    said the following:

    All I really have to say, this is totally one sided towards Guildwars to start. Pretty fucking gay if you ask me. Honestly, why didn’t you name teh artical “I <3 guildwars, and here is why its better then Hellgate” Look, I was in GW closed beta, and it had a fuckton of bugs. Hell look at how long IWAY was overpowered, they arn’t fast on squishing problems. Honestly, you should compare Hellgate to Diablo 2, thats the game style they are shooting for. and compare Guildwars to World of Warcraft, thats the style GW was shooting to get.

    Its a bad comparison. GG

    Idiot.

  39. 31st December 2007 
    3:46 am         

    Moregrim
    said the following:

    Acctually, thinking back to when I played GW, I didn’t get a sence of “I’m a badass” When I played it. 15k armor to make you stand out! woosh! Honestly, it lacks depth, Some of us acctually like to do math and try to figure out what will make us rock face. Some of us acctually enjoy grinding for that next peice of sweet gear. GW lacks in these area’s. Guildwars is ok, but it has a ton of flaws.

    1. Invisible walls = Gay
    2. Skills, you got a ton, but pen and paper says some are better. So 150 skills and you only ever care to use MAYBE 40 of them.
    3. Skill to play, a total moron can play this, no form of tanking… Its just a retard fest.
    4. Armor, There is no point in getting better armor 9 times out of 10, because it doesn’t get any better. -.-
    5. Builds suck, I hate so bad how GW has become “YOU MUST HAVE THIS BUILD TO COME”
    6. PvP = Rigged, i’m sorry, but it sucks that you have to have a blank rating to come into a PvP, so you cant get groups, thus new players hate it.
    7. I’ve already lost this argument, because your all quick to judge games since Hellgate has been out what, two months? When GW came out, it lacked alot of things your glorifying in this post.

  40. 31st December 2007 
    9:38 pm         

    thedocta45
    said the following:

    nice review.

  41. 31st December 2007 
    11:15 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    =========================================================

    @thedocta45:
    Thanks. :mrgreen:

    =========================================================

    @Moregrim:
    Nice feedback, mate! ๐Ÿ˜›
    However, the cold hard fact still remains that during the initial launch of both games, Guild Wars still totally outperforms Hellgate : London in many aspects, the above listed ten (10) is only a small part of it. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    =========================================================

    @JJ PornoGraphy:
    Merry Belated Christmas and Happy New Year to you, mate! ๐Ÿ˜€
    Thanks for the support! ๐Ÿ˜‰

    =========================================================

    @depresso:
    Mate, actually the above listed ten (10) comparisons are applicable to the game as a whole, not only limited to regions. ๐Ÿ™„

    =========================================================

    @nysilver:
    Yeah, this comparison is pretty much Guild Wars biased since I am a Guild Wars fan. ๐Ÿ˜‰
    Not to mention that Guild Wars does outperforms Hellgate : London in all the above listed ten (10) comparisons. ๐Ÿ™„

    =========================================================

    @Everyone:
    Happy New Year! ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    =========================================================

  42. 3rd January 2008 
    6:06 am         

    JJ PornoGraphy
    said the following:

    @Moregrim

    If someone who write one sided review is gay….Trust me…we have a lot of gays in this world. ๐Ÿ˜†

    This review is made by Deimos…it mean this is how he feel about this topic….and it normally not every one agree with him.

    And turst me…if we compare Hellgate to Diablo 2…maybe it worst more than this.

    I think you still get a wrong point…specially mine. ๐Ÿ™„

    “150 skills and you only ever care to use MAYBE 40 of them.”…that what u say isn’t it??…Ok didn’t u even try to thinking about?? why they make that 110 useless skills?? ๐Ÿ™„

    When people look at that skills and say “ok…this is useless”. But a lot of people forgot…the game maker is not stupid…something u can notice…they notice too.

    But if they know…why they still make it?? answer is simple…that skills can be use…and the one who have to find the way to use is we…the player.

    For u…that skills is useless…but for some people…this is challenge.

    I can tell u…conut only my pure necro skill builds…I have 25-30 skills in use list…If count all build with other sub-class…I have 50-60 skills in use list…and this is just only 1 char…I still have other 4 char…waiting for a new skill builds.

    Tell u the ture…it alway make me feel great…when I can combine some useless skill and make a combo…and I can use it in real battle.

    For someone who want to try something new…try to make a different…try to use his brain to create something new…If u call that person is “A Totally Moron”…ok that person is me…Hi!!! nice to meet u. ๐Ÿ˜†

    And I agree with u…this is just a fest…it just make for fun…but this is a main point when we play games…isn’t it?? ๐Ÿ‘ฟ

    Sorry…if my question is too rudeness…But if u not play games for fun…what is your F*CKING REASON to play game?? โžก

    Sorry again about my rudeness. ๐Ÿ™„

    And u know?? this idea is good in business way too…If u don’t get what I say…allow me to explain. ๐Ÿ˜Ž

    – Some useless skill can’t be use if u play only GW:FC…but if that skill combine with other skill from GW:NF…it became good combo.

    – Some class in GW:FC is became strong if we use sub-class from GW:NF. ๐Ÿ™„

    If we want to do that…we have to get both part right?? It’s mean another box of GW can be sold. โžก

    Ok….this is not main reason for buy a new game box…but for someone who love to play this game already…this is another good reason to buy a other part…isn’t it?? ๐Ÿ™„

    More skills…more class…more story to play…more strong…who don’t want it?? ๐Ÿ˜†

    About the armor…this is alway happen in all games. when we already have a good one…why we have to change?? because it look good more than old one??

    This give a choice for a player…If player want only qualify…they not have a point to buy a new one. But If they want something look good…they can pay of a new one.

    U can change new armor every time u get a good one more than ur armor…until u can find Maximum armor…and after that…this feeling is happen when u see a new armor but it’s worst more than u old one…It’s a same thing.

    But in GW…it feeling happan fast more than other games. ๐Ÿ˜†

    If u hate this โ€œYOU MUST HAVE THIS BUILD TO COMEโ€ so bad…why u not try to proof them wrong??…did u even try?? ๐Ÿ™„

    And reason about we have to get some rating for go to play PVP…the answer is simple too…they want to give the new player to get a chance to learn & practice about how to fight in PVP.

    Did u know what going to happen…when we let newcomer who don’t know how to fight in PVP go in battle field…CORPSE…they will get kill and make his team lost. โžก

    Oh!!! BTW…normally game review should made after game release in short time…normally is take time 1-2 week.

    I think…Deimos wait 2 month is long enough. ๐Ÿ™„

    ==================================================

    @Deimos

    Don’t misunderstanding me!!! I didn’t support u!!! ๐Ÿ‘ฟ

    I’m “A Totally Moron” remember?? ๐Ÿ˜†

    I’m just a stupid guy…who alway say something stupid. HA!!! HA!!! HA!!! HA!!! ๐Ÿ˜†

  43. 15th February 2008 
    6:04 pm         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @JJ PornoGraphy:
    Terribly sorry for the late reply! ๐Ÿ˜•
    Aiya! You are not a moron ler. ๐Ÿ˜ฏ
    You are a smart PC Gamer. ๐Ÿ˜‰

  44. 8th March 2008 
    4:36 am         

    ugh
    said the following:

    Hellgate is just a better game period IMO. The writer obviously favours Guild Wars more. Hellgate is an action RPG. You acctually have to aim and hit the target which require a hint of skill. Guild wars is boring as ****. 450 abilities and they are all the same!!!

    The armor and Weapon systems of Guild Wars is the worst I’ve ever seen. Armor has minimal customization. In the end they all max out to the same thing. Hellgate has randomized gear so when it is good you are truly lucky.

    At least you can jump on objects in Hellgate. You can use them to your advantage. The environment is much more interactive.

    -I like to aim to hit my target.
    -I like to time my granades!
    -I like to get on cars so the monsters can’t hit me as easy.
    -I would rather play WOW than guild wars.
    -I like getting new exciting weapons!!
    -I like getting a large selection of armor/weapon drops.
    -Hellgate should be in it’s own category, it is innovative and it acctually fun. It is different from the usual MMO.

  45. 8th March 2008 
    5:05 am         

    Deimos Tel`Arin
    said the following:

    @ugh:

    Hellgate is just a better game period IMO.

    It could be, if it did not suffer so many problems during its initial launch. โžก

    Anyway, it caters for a different crowd of gamers. ๐Ÿ™‚

    The writer obviously favours Guild Wars more.

    Of course. I stopped playing Hellgate : London for quite some time but I still play Guild Wars every now and then. ๐Ÿ˜€

    Hellgate is an action RPG. You acctually have to aim and hit the target which require a hint of skill. Guild wars is boring as ****. 450 abilities and they are all the same!!!

    The “aim and hit” in Hellgate : London is just for funs and does not really requires much skill. It is fun though, being able to aim and shoot. ๐Ÿ˜

    The thousands of skills in Guild Wars are quite different not the same, actually. ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    The armor and Weapon systems of Guild Wars is the worst Iโ€™ve ever seen. Armor has minimal customization. In the end they all max out to the same thing. Hellgate has randomized gear so when it is good you are truly lucky.

    Guild Wars’ equipment system is best for PvP while Hellgate : London’s is best for PvE. 2 different systems. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    At least you can jump on objects in Hellgate. You can use them to your advantage. The environment is much more interactive.

    Disadvantage actually, you can easily get stuck in many places. ๐Ÿ˜†

    -I like to aim to hit my target.
    -I like to time my granades!
    -I like to get on cars so the monsters canโ€™t hit me as easy.
    -I would rather play WOW than guild wars.
    -I like getting new exciting weapons!!
    -I like getting a large selection of armor/weapon drops.
    -Hellgate should be in itโ€™s own category, it is innovative and it acctually fun. It is different from the usual MMO.

    I have not played it for a very long time. ๐Ÿ’ก

    Stopped playing it last time due to the plenthora of bugs that is making the game very much less enjoyable. ๐Ÿ˜•

    Put it this way, Guild Wars would be more enjoyable for those who like to play:-

    Counter Strike:
    – Everything is balanced
    – The player with the better skills wins

    Hellgate : London would be more appealing for those who like to grind:-

    World of Warcraft
    – The player with the higher level wins
    – If same level, then the one with better equipment and skills wins

  46. 17th July 2008 
    3:58 am         

    Soy Oil
    said the following:

    http://hellgateguru.com/2008/07/flagship-studios-is-dead/

    Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I had to “Animate Dead Thread” here. Good riddence to bad rubbish! My own experience playing this game was horrible from start to finish. They should have just named it Failgate: Lamedon, and released it as a parody of the genre. You want to know how former Blizzard employees do it RIGHT, pick up Guild Wars. ๐Ÿ˜€

  47. 26th December 2008 
    7:40 am         

    Watch Yes Man
    said the following:

    Hellgate had my attention for 3 days. Still play guild wars…

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